Galatians 4 Bible Study | From Liberal To Champion For Jesus Christ Lauren's Testimony

Galatians 4 Bible Study. My wife, Lauren, joins us, offering a stirring testimony that shines as a beacon of hope and exemplifies the profound transformation from Liberal Atheist to Champion Christian Conservative for Jesus Christ. 

This episode isn't just about theological musings; it's a candid look at the real-life hurdles we face and the victories we claim through steadfast belief. We tackle the delicate issues of family communication, sibling rivalries, and mental health struggles, laying bare the personal stories that demonstrate the resiliency of faith in sculpting identities and illuminating the path through life's dimmest passages. We also witness the poignant transitions from atheism to Christianity and how these shifts profoundly affect relationships and personal evolution.

Prepare for an emotional journey as we recount the harrowing tale of a near-death childbirth experience, underscoring the indispensable role of faith and community in surmounting life's formidable challenges. We close with a powerful invocation for fellowship, protection, and harmony under God, reminding you of the indomitable strength found in the full armor of faith. Join us for an episode that is as enriching as it is enlightening—a sanctuary for those seeking solace and fortitude on their spiritual voyage.

Christian Warrior Talk is Sponsored by Trident Shield, your trusted ally in violence preparedness. Trident Shield helps safeguard your loved ones with expert training and consulting. Trident Shield, defending faith through empowered preparedness because together, we save lives."

Chapters

• 0:00 Warrior Training and Testimony Tuesday
• 8:27 Inheritance and Freedom in Christ
• 25:34 Family Dynamics and Communication Struggles
• 30:25 Struggles With Self-Esteem and Relationships
• 34:14 Sibling Rivalry and Personal Struggles
• 40:02 Navigating Atheism and Christianity Transition
• 51:18 Exploring Christianity and Marriage Perspectives
• 1:00:03 Journey to Motherhood and Faith
• 1:15:48 Testimony of a Near-Death Birth
• 1:30:48 Prayer for Fellowship and Protection

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:39

There we go I should sound way better now by studying his holy word and by studying his holy word through prayer. And then, three, we spend time in fellowship with iron, sharpening iron, and through corporate prayer. So those are the three battles. This is also the home of the Christable Challenge. This is a challenge where we submit our lives daily, all aspects of our lives daily, to our Lord and Savior, jesus Christ. We do that by submitting our faith, making our faith first in our life. Two, by deliberately pouring into our family other members of the body of Christ, so that could be pouring into your husband, wife, son, daughter, mother, uncle, cousin, whoever, or your neighbor or the person at the checkout counter at your grocery store. Three, fitness making sure that we are functional and a good vessel for the Holy Spirit. Four fundamentals this is your skill set. You're always sharpening or adding to your skill set. That's what makes you valuable to yourself, your family and your community. And then, lastly, finances trying to making sure to avoid the pitfalls of excessive debt and pursuing and the traps of pursuing stuff, worldly stuff, and using the war chest that God gave you wisely. So so that's what we do here. For those of you who have been tuning in for a while now. You know that and you guys have to hear that every night. But I do that because it's important for people to know, when they come here, what we're about, and we can't forget that. So I also want to announce tonight that my wife will be giving her testimony. It's testimony Tuesday and we're going to do a testimony, I hope, every Tuesday, and we're going to do a testimony, I hope, every Tuesday, and so I gave mine a few weeks ago, adrian gave his last week, and tonight Lauren, during the fellowship portion, will be giving her testimony. So you know and that's always a very special thing for me, you know, being that I played a small part in her you know, testimony when I get to heaven, the crown I'm going to be most joyful about that I lay at Christ's feet is going to be Lauren, because she's such a powerful, powerful force from the Lord. She's so inspiring, powerful, powerful force from the lord, she's so inspiring, she, she, she's just really grown into an amazing woman of god. So, um, but of course, being lauren, she's around rustling chickens right before this, so she's going to come in here probably covered, covered in feathers and chicken poop and and a million other things going on, so she's probably going to come in all frazzled dazzle, but enjoy, she's awesome. And for all those of you who've been hearing about Lauren, this is your chance to see her and hear her story. She used to be on the show all the time with me back before kiddos, but since Yaya and Magnus it's been a no-go. So, anyways, let's get our first battle won and then let's get into Galatians 4 tonight for our second battle. All right, so let's go to war.

Speaker 1: 4:21

Heavenly Father, lord, we thank you, thank you for all of our second battle. All right, so let's go. Let's go to war.

Speaker 1: 4:24

Heavenly Father, lord, we thank you. We thank you for all of our blessings, all of our protections, lord, no matter how bad our lives may be right now they could be an awful lot worse and we thank you that they're not. In fact, most of us right now, lord, are living extremely blessed lives. You have protected us from catastrophe. You have strengthened us to get through the challenges we've been through. We thank you, Lord. Your grace is so amazing. You gave us this amazing creation to experience. You didn't have to make food taste good, but you did. You didn't have to make this world beautiful, but you did. You didn't have to make flowers smell good, but you did. Lord, you made everything so amazing and we thank you for that. We thank you for the sunrises and the sunsets, for the cold breeze on a hot day and a warm fire the warmth of a fire on a cold day for the sound of waves breaking on the ocean and children's laughter, to your mighty creation of mountains and solar eclipses, universes, the oceans, rivers, streams and all the amazing creatures and plants that you gave here for us. Lord, we thank you. We also thank you most of all for us, lord, we thank you. We also thank you most of all for your holy grace, your saving grace, that you chose us when we were still traitors and wrote us into the book of life before the foundations of the earth, while we were still your enemy. You saved us. So, lord, we pray that this time glorifies you and only you. We pray that this time serves you and only you, and we pray that we serve you with every beat of our hearts, proclaim you with every breath of our lungs. In Jesus name, we pray, amen. Alright, battle number one done.

Speaker 1: 6:52

Now let's get into Galatians 4. How do you remember where I sent all my glasses Galatians 4, chapter 4, galatians, chapter 4, verse 1, and I'm reading out of the English Standard Version so, if we remember yesterday, paul is correcting the Galatians who are being influenced by Judaizers. The Gentiles obey Jewish tradition and law and circumcision and dietary things and everything else, and Paul has passed and he's pushing back on them. Sons and heirs I mean the heirs, as long as he is a child is no different than a slave, though he is the owner of everything, but he is under the guardians and managers until the date set by his father. This is true as children. You do what your parents tell you. You go here and do that, and you don't have a lot of freedom until you come of age, and you don't have a lot of freedom until you come of age.

Speaker 1: 8:27

In the same way, we also, when we were children, were enslaved to the elementary principle of the world. But when the fullness of time had come, god sent forth his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those who are under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons. Because you are sons. God has sent the spirit of his son into our hearts, crying Abba, father, so you are no longer a slave but a son, and if a son, then an heir through God. A slave but a son, and if a son, then an heir through God. So what he's saying here is that the Jewish people before were slaves to the law because they were still immature, and that Jesus Christ, who was sent at the appointed time, was there to bring them their inheritance. Now we are heirs to the kingdom of God.

Speaker 1: 9:30

Paul's concern for the Galatians Formally, when you did not know God, you were enslaved to those that by nature are not gods. Many theologians think he's talking about when he was pagans and all their pagan rituals were like demon worship. But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how can you turn back again to the weak and worthless elementary principles of the world whose slaves you want to be once more? You observe days and months and seasons and years. I am afraid I may have labored over you in vain Now when I look down into my study Bible and I pull up 410, because that didn't really mean much to me when I read this days and months and seasons we're all part of the ceremonial laws of the Mosaic Covenant. So they are celebrating Jewish holidays and observing Jewish things that they need not do because they are not under it. They are Christians, not Jews, and Paul is saying he feels like he might have wasted his time over them.

Speaker 1: 10:50

Brothers, I entreat you, become as I am, for I also have become as you are. You did me no wrong. You know. It is because of bodily ailment that I preached the gospel to you at first, and though my condition was a trial to you, you did not scorn or despise me, but received me as an angel of God, as Christ Jesus. So it appears that when Paul was ministering to them, it was because he was ill and they were taking care of him, and he was a burden to them, and they took very good care of him.

Speaker 1: 11:25

What, then, has become of the blessing you felt? For I testified to you that, if possible, you would have gouged out your eyes and given them to me, basically saying you guys were so you know, full of the holy spirit and were on such the right course that, you know, while I was ill, you would have given and done everything because you felt so blessed. Have I then become your enemy by telling you the truth? They make much of you. These are the false teachers, but for no good purpose. They want to shut you out that you may make much of them. He's saying that they're preaching this for their own selfish reasons. It is always good to be made much of good purpose, not only when I am present with you, my little children, for whom I again am in the anguish of childbirth, until Christ is formed in you. I wish I could be present with you now to change my tone, for I am perplexed about you.

Speaker 1: 12:32

He's basically saying he's going through child labor again with them, as he did the first time when he was, you know, discipling them. And he's going through it all over again because they have backslidden and been deceived, them. And he's going through it all over again because they have backslidden and been deceived, picking up in verse 21 example of hagar and sarah. So he's going to go back to the old testament and show two different slavery and freedom. Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not listen to the law?

Speaker 1: 13:04

For it is written, written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman, one by a free woman. But the son of the slave was born according to the flesh, while the son of the free woman was born through promise. Sarah convinced Abraham to sleep with her maid because she didn't believe God's promise, because she was barren and old and she thought it impossible, and rightly so. Other than that God promised her that she would give them a child, that it would be impossible, she had gone through menopause and all those other things. So she said sleep with her maid. And that was done to the flesh, not trusting in God, while the son of the free woman was born through promise. She did conceive and was born, and just like God said. Now this may be interpreted allegorically.

Speaker 1: 14:06

These women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery. She is Hagar. Now Hagar is Mount Sinai, in Arabia. She corresponds to the present Jerusalem. She is in slavery with her children, the Jews, but the Jerusalem above in heaven is free and she is our mother. For it is written Rejoice, o barren one who does not bear, break forth and cry aloud, you who are not in labor, for the children of the desolate one will be more than those of the one who has a husband. Now you brothers like Isaac. Isaac are children of promise, but just at the time he, I'm sorry, but just at the time, he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the spirit. So also it is now.

Speaker 1: 14:58

But what does the scripture say? Cast out the slave woman and her son, for the son of the slave woman shall not inherit with the son of the free woman. So, brother, we are not children of the slave, but of the free woman. He's talking about casting out the Jews. He's talking about casting out the Jews. They are to be cast out and Christians are now the new Jews, basically the new sons of heaven.

Speaker 1: 15:34

There's a lot of argument over replacement theology and a lot of people come down on different sides of this equation and I don't know if anyone's successfully debated the conclusion. Most of the American church is built on the belief that Christians are the new. Then the new, you know, the church has become God's people, as basically Paul writes over and over and over. That's my leaning on this is that you know the Jews when they are saved, the ones that are saved won't be Jews, they'll be Christians. They're not getting in unless they call Jesus Christ, lord and Savior, right. So that's where it is on that, you know. And Again, I'm not a PhD in those studies, but I think to me it seems pretty darn clear.

Speaker 1: 16:30

We're going to go to break now and we're going to come back, and Lauren, are you ready to come on after a short break, or are you still wrestling chickens? She's here and she even put on a different shirt for you guys. You guys are special. We'll be back in one minute, so we're back and I want to do a mic check. Hello, hello, hello, hello. All right, let me know if you guys can hear Lauren and let me know if I need to crank her up or anything, because I'm a little loud and she's a little quiet. We're kind of opposites in many ways Quiet, but we balance each other well. So, adrienne or Bob or someone, give us a thumbs up Loud and clear.

Speaker 1: 17:21

Thanks, adrienne. Thank you, adrienne, hi Troy, so I called you today, troy, I just want to let you know I called you. But anyways, this is my amazing, incredible wife Lauren, who has, I think, a great testimony and, like I've said before, it's not all blood and guts, although it is life and death, eternal life and eternal death. But it's not like some. She wasn't a prostitute and strung out on drugs and pinch drinking until she was born.

Speaker 1: 18:14

Mine's the vanilla version, all that, but she was. I think she can relate to most of you and um, and I've and it's funny you know all the times I've told my testimony. You know, whatever you know, we get stopped in public and some overlawns all the times we've been stopped in public.

Speaker 3: 18:35

The one time the one time our waitress happened to go to our church.

Speaker 1: 18:43

So, anyways, such hype, it's not hype, it's just genuine and it's good and ours is. So I'm going to pretend like I don't know you. I'm going to pretend I'm going to be interviewed, interviewed, looking at me this way, is I this way?

Speaker 2: 19:02

so I'll just test my interviewing skills.

Speaker 1: 19:06

I'm not used to uh to doing it this way, but we're gonna have to do it okay okay, it's all right well it doesn't matter, that part doesn't matter. Look at you on the camera over here. Okay, I love you. There we go. And then large vest okay, so were you raised with any faith no, I wasn't.

Speaker 2: 19:34

So I was um born and raised in preeport, Maine, so southern coastal Maine I have my parents were married, for they're still married, so never had to deal with kind of a broken family. I have an older sister she's two years older than I am and that was our family unit and we were not raised with faith at all. All I knew kind of my understanding of my faith influences or lack thereof through my parents was that my mom had been raised Catholic but was not practicing, and my dad had been raised in the church for some amount of time as a youth and something had kind of turned him off from it. He developed a bad taste for it and didn't my understanding of it that he he did not want my mom or just us to be raised in faith. He wanted us to be able to choose when we were older. Um just didn't really feel like that was anything that we should be kind of exposed to um as children so did you go to church, like on christmas, easter?

Speaker 2: 20:57

yeah, in my very young years I did, when his mom was alive and lived up near us, um, after she was, um a widow by that point. So, um, she was in a nursing home and we would go to, yeah, like the Christmas Easter type um mass, um I'm not even sure where, what kind of churches we went to, honestly, but that was it, and I remember in that, like when I was very young, I enjoyed it. I have a memory of kind of saving all my pennies you know cause I wanted that to, like donate my pennies at one of the times that we went to church. Um, that faded away very quickly and after she passed, when I was pretty young, um, I don't recall ever going again.

Speaker 1: 21:45

You, know this is a new, new part of your testimony that I don't recall hearing before, but it's waking all the children yeah, so um, but I find it interesting that you're wired from go yeah, I don't know, that's just a little memory that I have.

Speaker 2: 22:10

It really striking me at that moment I wanted to give. When you have change as a kid, that's kind of a big deal. You don't have a lot of it, so I just remember that.

Speaker 1: 22:21

I don't know where that came from so you don't ever recall doing grace around the table oh gosh, no, no, definitely not.

Speaker 2: 22:31

I um, whenever my cousins would visit, I remember, or if we visited them um, they would do kind of the generic grace around the table and it was kind of always the you know, looking at people like they're weird, you know sentiment and never participating in it. But that was, that was it, and I wouldn't say that I saw much kind of walking out of faith in any of my extended family other than kind of table grace.

Speaker 1: 23:01

So you were educated in the secular Northeast, like myself. Was theology ever presented or creationism ever presented? Was there any type of biblical reinforcement or option in your public school life?

Speaker 2: 23:20

No Much like your education it was. I mean any scientific theories were presented as fact. When it comes to evolution and everything surrounding kind of anything other than you know, the biblical things you know, you're not encouraged to think about that at all. Any classmates that I had that ever shared any kind of faith. I thought they were just ridiculous, like I could not understand how anyone would be silly enough to believe anything other than evolution.

Speaker 1: 23:55

Now you know, we have something that we call breadcrumbs. Breadcrumbs are things or people that God puts in our life at certain times that help lean us home to heaven. I know in high school you had a teacher who did that. So what was your first real exposure to like a true Christian? Because there are a lot of Christian lights, but who was the first real?

Speaker 2: 24:21

Christian? I would say probably, probably, Mr Watts, Um, he was my band teacher. I was a saxophone nerd, Um, and I don't recall anyone prior to him that certainly would talk about it in school, Um, because really there was not much support for that conversation in school. And again, just, I mean he was an adult who I respected greatly, but it blew my mind that someone I respected like that could believe in something so fake like God and Jesus and all of that stuff, you know, and so I would.

Speaker 2: 24:58

I would never not a big debater, but I would kind of challenge him some on it or make it clear that I thought that he was ridiculous for having that belief. Um, and he, I mean, he always took it well, took it with a smile and rebutted where he could. And I have since sent him a message, you know, telling him about kind of where I am now in my life. And he said I have heard that from you know, multiple of my students who I used to debate, you know, in high school that have come back and been saved. And so, Mr Watts, I would say, was definitely my first breadcrumb.

Speaker 1: 25:35

So on paper I mean you had an intact family. So on paper I mean you had an intact family. You know your parents had lived responsibly so they were available and around you know you weren't a latchkey kid, no, no, you always had someone in the home. And on paper you know all-American dream. You know you can go but, as we know, we're born empty vessels. Either either the Holy spirit's going to fill you or the world's going to fill you. So what you know? Demons and what struggles flooded into you because you didn't have that identity of Christ passed down to you.

Speaker 2: 26:14

Yeah, um well, I never. So I I'd say if I kind of went the opposite of the hell raiser, I was a perfectionist and a people pleaser and that's still what I struggle with most. I would say, Um, my parents yes, my mom was a stay at home mom and she was amazing at kind of giving us, you know, a wonderful childhood experience. Um, my sister growing up was pretty difficult, kind of an emotionally difficult daughter for them and sister for me, and um, I just always tried to counter that and would try to go above and beyond on kind of making up for anything that they were struggling with with her and so that just I would say, got it into my DNA, on being a people pleaser and trying to kind of clean up messes.

Speaker 2: 27:10

But my family was also very bad at communicating. We are not people who are comfortable talking about issues. Everything always has to be kind of sunny and smiley and no problems, and you sweep it under the rug, Um, so I never really learned how to handle conflict appropriately. Um, I would just kind of stuff it in Um, and you know, my parents kind of just let my sister and I kind of try to figure out our own dynamic, which was not healthy and I remember coming this there's a lot in between where I'm talking about and then I did a visit home and there was a problem to actually confront my parents about it and I was crying and someone came home and you know, my parent the parent I was talking to quickly left because they didn't want anyone to know that. You know there was a problem, that there was crying, and so it was just like taboo, like don't have a problem wrap it up.

Speaker 1: 28:11

So so talk about that a little bit. So so there, I want to make sure I understand. So you, you were confronting your parents about something.

Speaker 2: 28:19

Yeah, well, I was having a hard conversation, I think it was with I can't remember if my mom or my dad, and yeah. And someone came and someone came. No, it's just. My other parent came home and it was like, oh well, we don't want them to know that you're crying kind of you know having a hard time and um. So it just never really encouraged to have anything other than a neutral or happy emotion so emotionally suppressed?

Speaker 2: 28:50

were they emotionally available? I didn't have a very emotionally close relationship with my parents and I'm probably just as much at fault for that, for whatever reasons in like, you know, middle school and stuff that you start to pull away, and I just I would say there was a failure to foster closest, even though we were all under the same roof and so we all I mean we loved each other and we would, but it wasn't. We were not a very let's enjoy hanging out together family.

Speaker 1: 29:20

Well, I mean, there's a lot of personalities in that too. But I mean I remember something when I, when I met you and, like you, didn't tell your parents you love them. Yeah, when I first met you, you know, I was really, you know.

Speaker 2: 29:34

And that's yeah, that's part of the like. We're bad at communicating and sharing emotion. I told them I loved them when I was little.

Speaker 2: 29:47

And then something got in my head about it at some point in like elementary school or middle school, I'm not sure when. Yeah, some, I honestly don't remember where it came from, but in my mind it was like love is like for moms and dads, like kind of the icky love. You know that, it was like romantic love, and so it was weird for me to say I love them. I don't have any idea where that came from, um, but yeah, I stopped saying I love you to them and they would kind of awkwardly say, and then it would be like really weird and I wouldn't say it back and I'm ashamed of that. I really have no idea where that came from. And as part of my healing, kind of after I've been saved, I do say that now and it really surprised them and but we've kind of gotten into a rhythm of that again.

Speaker 1: 30:26

So you became a people pleaser. What other afflictions did you suffer, you know? Did you have depression? Didn't you have? You know? Did you one? Did you feel like anybody would ever fight for you? Was anyone your defender or somebody who would come and fight for you? Did you ever feel like somebody?

Speaker 2: 30:55

Not, not really. And like my sister would always put me down in front of friends because she struggled with if any of their friends tried to have a friendship with me. She that she took that she didn't take that well and so she was always belittling me in front of them. Um, and I don't like I don't really call my parents or anyone else really stepping in on that Um, I did struggle with not clinical depression, but I definitely started having kind of bouts of mild, mild to moderate depression through high school and then to college. Um, I tried telling my mom at one point that I was feeling depressed and she was like oh, lauren, you're not depressed and kind of wouldn't let me explore that any further. Um, so just just kind of experiences like that. Um, and then there's there's some more of the not feeling supported kind of as I went through college and young adult stage.

Speaker 1: 31:57

So, um, you know most of us, when we acquire ones like this, we invest in our first boyfriend and our whatever boyfriend, girlfriend, whatever, and that becomes our support structure. How did you work? Was that ever the case with you? Did you find, you know, a support and structure in that?

Speaker 2: 32:28

Yeah, well, I had. I had a one very good friend through middle school, high school, and then I did start dating someone when I was a sophomore in high school and was very, very committed to that relationship. I was never kind of, it never struck me to be a serial dater or anything like that, so that was kind of the person and I was in a relationship with that person for like eight years.

Speaker 1: 32:59

Right. So you know. When did you start having sex? Were you having sex in sophomore year, junior year, high school year, was it? You know? Do you remember? I know you're saying you're on birth control. Yeah, a lot of girls are on birth control just for the hormones or whatever to help me deal with this or bad skin or whatever. But do you remember? Like where that?

Speaker 2: 33:21

well, I was on birth control originally because of cramping issues. Right, that's okay. Um, but um, a couple years into the relationship and any like discipling from your parents.

Speaker 1: 33:35

No, anything like hey, obviously you're spending a lot of time with one person yeah, no, I mean they I mean they yeah, no, they, they liked him.

Speaker 2: 33:44

Um, they never really dove deep into kind of what, what we were doing in our time, but, um, they were comfortable with him coming over to my house and me going to his house, um, and I think they were just comfortable that it was a very committed relationship. They wouldn't be happy with knowing if we were doing anything physical, but they also didn't really do anything to stop opportunities for that Okay.

Speaker 1: 34:09

So what was probably your biggest you know again? I just want to put this in perspective. We've all had like drunk things where our parents caught us or somebody when we started experimenting with alcohol. Do you remember like the big time, you like the big letdown, like where you let them down for something and you know and did that wound you to where you held on to it for a long time.

Speaker 2: 34:39

Well, so my sister, they finally trusted us enough to. They went on their first vacation by themselves. She was a junior and I was a sophomore. No, I would have been a freshman. She was a junior and I was a freshman in high school.

Speaker 2: 34:57

And so my sister decided to throw a house party, um, and I was horrified and scared about that because I was I'm a goody goody.

Speaker 2: 35:05

I don't want anything to do with that like letting my parents down. But I also didn't want to kind of tell on my sister, um, so I was in the house, but everywhere that they would go, I would try to go kind of the opposite end of the house, um, and they of course found out, um, and they grounded my sister for months and took away every single privilege. But then I also got grounded for like a month and a half and lost all of my privileges as well for just not telling anybody. Um, and and so that kind of, and when we they, they kind of divided us up and my, I think my dad would handle my sister and my mom handled me in the initial conversations, and my mom said you know, we expected this from your sister, but we never expected this from you and so just kind of being held up to that standard and kind of compared compared against my sister, like that, and um, just, I've always hung on to that.

Speaker 1: 36:08

So do you feel like, um, obviously this created a barrier between you and your parents and all that? I think the biggest injury was probably between you and your sister. You wanted to be friends with your sister right.

Speaker 2: 36:27

Yeah, I think everyone would hope to be friends with their siblings, but kind of through public school and you know, you're never really around each other and any times that we were or if she was, you know, with friends, as I said, she would try to seem cool by belittling me. It just it really we didn't have any kind of closeness at all until she left for college and then we kind of didn't have to deal with each other so much and so any communications were able to be more neutral, right.

Speaker 1: 37:04

So during this phase where you get out of high school, you know you're not a big drinker, not a big partier. You know what's your plan.

Speaker 2: 37:15

Well, so I was. You know, my parents had always encouraged kind of going to college for your education, and so that was never really kind of questioned in any kind of way. My boyfriend went to a college in Virginia and I started at a college, gettysburg College in Pennsylvania, pennsylvania. I really wanted to work with animals. I've kind of growing up this is something that kind of skipped over I hated the thought of kids. Like I really I never enjoyed being around them. When my younger cousin was born, I thought she was obnoxious, like I just really really had no desire to be around kids, to ever want kids, um, and I just loved animals. I was kind of the typical default you don't like people, you want to work with animals because they're not horrible, so that was the kind of crazy.

Speaker 2: 38:07

I was like the crazy dog lady in in the making at that point. Um, so I I wanted to go to school to to learn how to work with animals in some capacity I wasn't really sure what, but so I ended up choosing Gettysburg. I think they had some animal program that I thought would be helpful, but I didn't really vet the school at all and they're very sorority, fraternity based, and that just was not my thing. So so, very quickly, I felt very isolated there and, um, I tried doing some of the like go to frat parties and stuff, and it just that wasn't, you know. So I started choosing to stay in on Friday and Saturday nights and you know everyone else would go out and just um, I had a very hard time connecting with people there because of that.

Speaker 1: 38:58

So different parts of time in your life. Did you ever feel like spiritual warfare, like where obviously not wanting kids? I would 100%, because I went through that. That's 100% the enemy coming in to separate you from your purpose, which is to make you know, go forth and multiply and do that. Were there anything else that you can remember? I know you know any horrible thoughts or any names that would come up or lies the enemy would tell you.

Speaker 2: 39:32

Yeah, I mean I know that you've talked about this in other kind of examples of spiritual warfare before and I can't remember what stage I was experiencing these thoughts, but kind of in tandem with you know, the occasional depression of while I was driving on a windy road, the voice pops in your head of you don't have to follow the road, you could just go straight and it would go over the cliff. And who's going to miss you? Like that kind of stuff. And I don't have, I don't know, I don't care. I remember when those things started, but, um, definitely never. Never thought about it seriously enough to do it, other than it was a very clear thought in my mind.

Speaker 2: 40:12

Right and then um things don't work out, your boyfriend yeah, so we made it through, all through college and then, yeah, so the majority of the eight years or whatever it was, really was long distance and kind of the thought in my mind after kind of committing that time was we were going to get past college and then we'll be ready to get married and it'll have been worth the long distance We'll be. You know that that's what this relationship is for. So I ended up going down to Charlottesville, virginia, after we both graduate and because he was staying down there for an internship and I end up getting a job with a service dog organization, so I kind of figured out, oh this is might be something that I want to do as a career. So they offer me to stay and he finishes up his internship, decides he's done in Virginia and goes back to Maine, even though he doesn't have a job, he's just going to go back and live with his dad.

Speaker 2: 41:15

So really had no purpose in going back up, other than I don't want to be in Virginia and so left me there still in the relationship. So it went right back to being a long distance relationship. So that was definitely a big emotional letdown and started me emotionally kind of splitting off. I ended up in that relationship still for another year to a year and a half, and at at that point I finally wisened up to this is not going anywhere. I am wasting my time being with someone who is not making any effort to be in the same town as me, let alone state any of the wound from you know, the abandonment wound from, possibly your sister, um or your parents.

Speaker 2: 42:05

Get tore open with that and did any of the depression get worse? I wouldn't say no. I mean, I think the after we had the opportunity to like really dive into our relationship and move forward with it and he still chose to leave and go back to being long distance, I would say my heart hardened and so by the time that, um, by the time that I finally called it off, I was just like I was done with it. So I, um, and I think so I, I let myself work through that for a while before we actually ended the relationship, um, so I was really actually happy to be out of that, but it was certainly, it was, confusing. I mean, you kind of wonder why, why, after you invest so much time in one person, for that to end that way.

Speaker 1: 42:53

So you would call yourself a devout atheist at this point, right? Yeah, I hadn't In college reaffirmed that with, I remember when we we can talk about that when we get to that next part. But you know, they definitely continued oh yeah, there was no.

Speaker 2: 43:09

There were no moments through college that ever made me question my belief that there was no God, that I was totally fine to die and go into the dirt and there's no hell. So that doesn't matter. Um, like I just it was. That was fine with me. I didn't have any emotional issues with death being final and that's that's it. It ends there. Um, once I moved down to to Virginia and there are a lot more Christians there and the people so secular Northeast.

Speaker 1: 43:44

as you move South, you come across way more, at least born again. Like you know, there's Catholics in every place, but they're the lightest of the light, catholics.

Speaker 2: 43:53

Yeah, so I. There's a lot of women who would work with the service dogs and so I would become. I was friends with them and most of them were Christian and so they would invite me to, you know, easter service or things like that, and I would, you know, politely decline, but it would always make me be very uncomfortable to get those invitations. Get those invitations. I never no curiosity at that point was kind of ignited on wanting to check it out or wanting to engage in conversations about it with any of those people. I just would. I would turn down any opportunity that came up. I was living on the property of someone who was the most wonderful Christian lady who has passed away now, but her testimony is beautiful, um, and I wish that I had taken her up on some of those conversations right, um, and she, she died of cancer, young, with family and husband and all that so um.

Speaker 1: 44:55

So we meet, yeah, and we start dating and you know I'm going to say my part and then go over. When I met Lauren, you know my Christianity had been gutted. My son Connor had really broke me from my baby Christian legs, you know, and watching him suffer, and so I kind of had a leg in the. I was a non-practicing Christian, you know. Believe there was God. I just got to repent beforehand. I was not living any way. That was Christian.

Speaker 2: 45:32

And then we meet and so just prior to us meeting kind of, a couple of things had potentially been changing in my life and the way I was managing. I was very depressed in Virginia so that my relationship had ended. I felt very alone, didn't really have anyone. I had a couple of older friends. I'm an old soul so like my friends are like More than 70.

Speaker 2: 46:04

Yeah, so that was about the age of the people that I was friends with. So I didn't really have anyone my age or life stage to connect to and I wasn't really satisfied with the job anymore. There was issues there. And so I had gone home in the beginning of August and I had decided that I was going to be wrapping up my work down in Virginia by the end of the year and moving back to Maine to live with my parents and and start a service dog organization up there. I had it all mapped out and so that was that was my plan when I went back down to Virginia after that trip up in August.

Speaker 2: 46:44

And then the other thing that I had I had a friend who was not the best influence, who kind of knew what was going on in my personal life, which was nothing, and was trying to encourage me to just like live a little looser, if you know what I mean. So, which is not anything I'd ever done, and I was starting to consider it to just, you know, have fun, you're in your twenties, you know, whatever. Um, and so I I had been act on that, but I was kind of becoming willing to do that. I didn't act on that, but I was kind of becoming willing to do that, which is not anything that I had been comfortable doing before. And then, two weeks after making this plan to move up to Maine again, I had a friend who heard about these Navy SEAL workouts in town but was way too scared to go by herself. So I asked if I would go. I had no interest in going. So I told her I would go. I had no interest in going, um, so I said, told her I'd go once and uh, so walk into the gym, meet Jason. And uh, I went. I went back more than once and um, we had we call it our Tuesday, cause it was the week after I started there and I just stayed for hours after that workout and just talking, and it was just.

Speaker 2: 48:05

I'd never had conversations like that before, um, and so I think we both knew immediately that there was, there was something to this relationship. I I fought that for a while on what it was going to be, but I think I probably knew it all along. But there was things on paper that my parents didn't wouldn't approve of, and so my people, pleaser self, didn't give into that for a while. But yeah, so I knew that Jason was a believer, but confused and trying to figure out what he was doing. And he knew that I was an atheist and he you know he'd been down that path himself before. Learn about it with him and engage in conversations and things like that. And I I said yes because I thought that I was going to kick him back over the line towards you know sanity and get rid of that silly Jesus stuff.

Speaker 1: 49:15

So I was at a point where, you know, I couldn't go back to being an atheist because I believed in creation. I believed in a creator, and so I was. Either I got a I have one leg in in Christianity and another, and you know, um, I can't believe. I forgot the term Agnostic. Agnostic, but you know, I believed in Jesus, so that wasn't ever a thing. But I was like I need to really explore this and see if I'm going to do this, because I was being torn it out on this and I said to Lauren hey, I'm going to figure out if I'm a Christian or not. Do you want to come with me? And your immediate thought in your head was what?

Speaker 2: 49:48

no, I'm. I'm going to get rid of this silly Jesus stuff. Like there's no way I'm going to lose this fight. Um and little did I know. Jason is a great um debater. He's a great convincer and he's great at poking holes. So he turned the skills that he used to have as an atheist poking holes in christianity.

Speaker 2: 50:11

He turned that as a christian, poking holes in my atheism and um you know, I was all you know, uppity and confident with my you know college education and, um, all that stuff that I had been never taught to question about Darwinism and you know all the mammals have. You know things that replicate fingers and all all the silly stuff that you're like, yeah, they definitely turned from you a whale to a gorilla or what you know I mean that makes sense.

Speaker 1: 50:44

I'm a single cell, amoeba too, you know.

Speaker 2: 50:46

So he was, I mean, just in like one of the first conversations. He's like why does that not point to a creator who is like that's a good design, I'm going to give that to all of the mammals. I was like that's a good design, I'm going to give that to all of the mammals. I was like that's a good point, you know. And so he very quickly unraveled all of the flimsy things that pretty much all of my beliefs and education stood on um, and so I was. Definitely I was became more willing to learn about um stuff related to Christianity, but I was very uncomfortable with it for a while and because I have people in my personal life, you know, back home, that wouldn't wouldn't like it Christianity or wouldn't understand what I was doing or now believing, I fought it for a long time and I wasn't willing to kind of admit to myself when I started changing, because I people pleasers, lauren, lauren, I didn't want to be different.

Speaker 1: 52:03

For the people who knew me before, so, when going after a rational thing, if there's one thing, uh, we almost call Lauren a cyborg she's so rational, you know, she, uh, she is logic incarnate. And, um, when you're dealing with a logic-based thinker you know we were debating micro macro evolution till, like two, three in the morning, I mean it was you know, she'd bring out her science books that would show a hand sorry, a hand uh, uh, a wing and a fin, and they all look the same and that's what she's talking like. Well, obviously, same. You invented wheel once and you just modify it and, to lauren's great credit, she didn't have such an ego that, like she was, she wanted truth, like once she was exposed, like myself, once. What do you mean? There's an I could be wrong on something. Well, you know she was hungry for the truth, um, and then I went to orw let's talk about that. Yeah, so we were.

Speaker 1: 53:02

So we were both never wanting kids you know, you know we're gonna stay single and not single. I mean, we're gonna be married but we're gonna be with kidless and live an adventure yeah and you know, and I was, and we get married and at that point so we were engaged and I was okay.

Speaker 2: 53:21

So I was still a professing atheist, although Jason was working on me and I was okay that he was a Christian, I didn't really because he wasn't really walking it out Like it wasn't actively going to church or things. So it didn't really affect my life for him to be. You know, at that point, and we were on the same page, we didn't want kids and that was all fine. And so he went to the Operation Restored Warrior program and he was not supposed to be calling me but he snuck calls while he was there and I could hear a tangible difference in his voice. You know, day two, when he was sharing some of the stuff that he was going through, and even though I didn't really believe it myself yet at that point, I was so happy for him to be experiencing those, those changes, and I could hear the change in his voice until on the phone, while he was still there, he said guess what? They made me? You know, discover why I've never wanted kids. And they healed it.

Speaker 2: 54:30

And now I want kids with you and as our marriage, my life flashed before my eyes, Cause, you know, we were still engaged and not married yet I was like, what is this going to do to everything? And so I was. I just was so sick to my stomach hanging up the phone. And so he comes home and he continues to you know, have that, you know, say things like that, and put his hand on my stomach and like you know, just that's not the way. And then, and then he was like, OK, I'll respect, if you never want kids, I'm not going to pressure you, but just know that if you ever change your mind, I definitely want kids. And I was like it's really just really uncomfortable with the whole thing. So it wasn't anywhere close to an immediate like okay, let's do it. And that persisted for through our getting married, so hold on.

Speaker 1: 55:29

So I ended up. My mission after ORW is I just think I got you know the demons taken off of me. I've got healing in my life. I understood everything on what, what had happened in my life in the first time. You know whether something miraculous happened or not. Through what happened there I was able to understand that abandonment wound, where I acquired my abandonment wound, how I went and how I was coping, all these other things, what that did to me and I was able to bring God into that and it changed everything about me. Like, from that point on, I haven't stopped serving God since ORW and so now my mission is I get to rescue. Person I love most in life is you, and Lauren is like the most stubborn person on the planet, like I am stubborn and I have nothing.

Speaker 1: 56:24

Nothing on this woman this woman again is the most stubborn person you'll ever meet in your life. So you know, I convene a small group, yeah, at the house.

Speaker 2: 56:36

So go, let's talk about that yeah, what you thought about that, yeah, so I was happy to host it and, um, I liked the people that were, you know couples that you know we were friends with. Um, so it was kind of a social opportunity, um, and I was willing to. Everyone knew that I was the only not saved person there and they were okay with me just kind of sitting and observing and taking it in and not really participating. Um, and did you say this already? I can't remember, but we were going to do like a deep dive in theology, um, but it quickly became apparent that several of the couples participating were having some significant marital marital issues really obvious. So jason decided to to pivot to um, the love and war marriage series. It's an eight week, it's a book you read and there's a like a workbook and all that stuff. Um, what's his name?

Speaker 1: 57:34

john aldrich, john eldridge, um, it's a really good marriage series, Really really good marriage series.

Speaker 2: 57:40

And so we dove into that and you read your chapter every week and then you talk about things with your spouse, and then you have your small group meeting and everybody shares.

Speaker 2: 57:54

And so it allowed me the opportunity.

Speaker 2: 57:56

You know, I was a we were newlyweds at that point and everything was sunshine and roses and we'd never had to deal with our own conflicts. But it allowed me to see how Christians were supposed to handle issues and kind of give me tools for that. And reading what you know the marital structure is supposed to look like that, you know how God designed it, you know what the roles of the husband, the roles of the wife, how they're supposed to interact with each other, I just found it to be a very beautiful thing and that opened up my mind so much to okay, if this is what Christianity means for marriage, what else in life is like? What? What else in life is, would it be like to be as Christian? Um, and so that, definitely by happy circumstances of us switching to that marriage series, um, happy circumstance of us switching to that marriage series definitely shifted me kind of internally on being much more open to exploring it Again. I wasn't mentally admitting that to myself for a while, but emotionally Jesus was definitely grabbing a hold of my heart.

Speaker 1: 59:13

And we were also going through church shopping. How did that work?

Speaker 2: 59:17

Not well. Jason will say that he made a few mistakes when he was trying to save me, and some of the church shopping experiences were not the best. There was a lot about kind of the organized structure of the church that just made me again really uncomfortable. There was a few that we went that you know it was related to communion and I felt like it was very obvious that I was the only person not participating in, which is, I'm sure, just I'm sure that wasn't the case, but just kind of to me it seemed like all spotlights on Lauren.

Speaker 2: 59:50

She's not participating in communion and, um, you know, or the songs that they were singing, or just there was a lot of those things that we went to that just this set me back a little bit. But I also will say that I would find myself, you know I would go for a lot of walks I was an obsessive dog walker at that point on our, on our property, dog lady in action, and so so you know, I'd be outside by myself, no kids at that point, and just quiet and worship songs would pop into my mind, which, you know, and I would kind of like tamp them down, but it was the worship songs from church that we had been to and um, they would just, they would keep coming out over any other music.

Speaker 1: 1:00:35

They would keep coming to mind um, which I think was on purpose so I tried every tactic in the world on my stubborn wife and but I never thought to try reverse psychology. And one day you know I'm sitting there working on her and I said this wasn't a tactic, it was like man, I can't believe this, you're never gonna be saved. He gave up on me. You're never gonna be saved. You're so darn stubborn, you can't be saved.

Speaker 2: 1:01:06

Yeah, then I said well, what if I already am? He was like wait what?

Speaker 2: 1:01:13

that's all I had to say, um, yeah, I didn't want him to give up on me. So I told him that it had worked. Um, yeah, so I think that was the kick in the pants of being given up on, to be like, okay, stop holding out on this. I I recognized in myself that I was, you know, I believed in, in God, I accepted Jesus and, um, it wasn't like this beautiful, like flip switched for me kind of moment. That's a lot most people have on, you know, they. The day that I was saved was you know. But, um, I was kind of the slow boil, um, but that night I said the, said the prayer, which I know is controversial on whether that, but uh, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:01:57

So from then on, so, um, did god like? Did you have moments or times or things like? That's the first time I've heard of the worship song. Was there any other thing that was changing? Did you feel depression, lightning, did you feel any type of thing? Was there any outstretch to you where you felt a presence or a peace or joy? And then we still got the big reveal coming up, which is the big review.

Speaker 2: 1:02:33

No, um, I don't recall if there's, like in the before, I kind of verbally and and outwardly accepted jesus. I don't recall what else might've been changing.

Speaker 2: 1:02:47

Um, you know, in the, in the depression that I was experiencing, that would kind of come and go. Um, I, and I would say that that was still kind of a a thing that I was working through. We called it my dark and twisties. Um, but no, so I I wouldn't say that anything else prior other than the worship song, that that I could say, okay, that was god giving me a nudge, or that I can recognize. Yeah, my, I was, I was fully changed. But um, I would say very quickly after oh, you're baptized yeah, so we got baptized.

Speaker 2: 1:03:25

Um, yeah, so we got baptized together. Even so, jason had been sprinkled right um, when he had first converted himself, um, and saved and, but he'd wanted submersion. So we took the opportunity to do that together at the church that we were going to at the time. Um, and yeah, that was a cool experience. It was definitely something way out of my comfort zone of doing it in front of a large group.

Speaker 2: 1:03:52

It was a massive crowd, I mean it was a big church so that I had to write down my little notes about what to say because I wasn't confident on you know, saying it was like a two minute testimony, but I had to write it down. But yeah, so I got baptized then and to my shame I'd say, I still I wasn't comfortable at that point sharing it really with people from kind of my previous life, so I did not like make a big deal of it to my parents and things like that, which I wish I'd had more joy and more confidence in sharing that moment with people who wouldn't understand it.

Speaker 1: 1:04:32

Well, you've definitely changed and evolved in that, that's for sure. So you're baptized, you're a Christian.

Speaker 2: 1:04:43

Now what? Very quickly God changed my heart on kids. So this kid hating lady was like I want to become a mom. And then I became really panicked that I wasn't going to be able to become a mom because my mom had issues physical issues for like nine years with miscarriages, before having my sister and me. So I then became very anxious that it wasn't going to happen for us now that I really wanted it. But that wasn't a problem. So we were able to have Bea pretty quickly.

Speaker 1: 1:05:21

After after deciding that we now wanted kids I'd say we pretty quickly were able to I got pregnant with b now being a mother like let's go through the milestones, you're saved, you get healed of not wanting kids, that that demonic oppression's off of you. I now you're the mom, and you're the most amazing mom on the planet. Your first kid was easy mode.

Speaker 2: 1:05:44

She was got to carry that. Um yeah so no, it was amazing, I mean it was. I'm so grateful that that he changed that in my heart.

Speaker 2: 1:05:56

and then I was able to experience that and, um, I was a liberal abortion supporting, you know, feminist girl before that and um having gone through pregnancy and then having my own baby as I just I and being a Christian, all kind of all wrapped up, um, I can't imagine abortion anymore, so that that sin was very abruptly taken from me as well, that kind of supporting that. So no, I mean it was amazing and I think I mean I had I had never really kind of one of the things that I struggled with in my initial baby stages of being Christian was kind of what's my purpose? And you know, you Jason was settling into his and you, you see people who are kind of being very active and and kind of outward in their discipling and witnessing and all of that stuff, and I, none of that felt quite right. But then having kids and you know, being a mom and being a wife and being a homemaker and kind of really exploring that identity, just that purpose is really what's resonated with me.

Speaker 2: 1:07:13

Uh, and anytime I kind of step out of those bounds. It doesn't feel nearly as good as and and fulfilling as when I'm doing that.

Speaker 1: 1:07:20

I've never even read of a mother better than you.

Speaker 2: 1:07:22

Well, Well, I'm sure every husband's going to say that about his baby mama but I appreciate that.

Speaker 1: 1:07:31

So it's all smooth sailing right. Like you're a Christian, you like to have kids. Now there's no struggles anymore.

Speaker 2: 1:07:38

So B was, as you say, easy mode and that didn't do anything to help, you know, with my modesty and humility with being a mom. And so then we had Yaya. When I had a miscarriage, I was briefly pregnant, so I was, I was I'm grateful that I was not emotionally kind of invested in that pregnancy for a long amount of time, but it was still. I mean it. It definitely, you know, it rocks you back, um, but was able to get pregnant again, kind of just a month later. So move forward with being happy about that pregnancy. Um, and I kind of really dove into health stuff during that time, um, and decided that I wanted to do home birth, and so we were down and we'd moved to Tennessee by that point.

Speaker 1: 1:08:33

Yeah. So COVID, masking up turn delivery, you know, mandatory vaccine and all that stuff, and we're like we want no part of that. Or Lauren said you want no part of that. And for the record, Lauren, are you in any way a liberal? No, no, I shouldn't, Because you dropped that out there.

Speaker 2: 1:08:48

I said I was.

Speaker 2: 1:08:50

I said I was was no, just sounding mad. No, I'm sane now. I'm sane and saved. That was also part of the everything that changed in that time frame. Yeah, so I decided I wanted the home birth, and so Jason was very supportive with that and we were able to have that experience here, found I had a Christian midwife and you know she prays as part of all of kind of your birth stuff, and so I just everything felt really great with that and then crashed and burned with Yaya, with that Um, and then crashed and burned with Yaya.

Speaker 2: 1:09:32

She came out angry like just minute one from out of the woods she came out angry and it was the hardest three months that I had ever experienced. To that to that point, especially because B was so darn easy that I was very rattled for having such a difficult I can't help this child, baby and so that was really really hard and we struggled, I think more than we'd ever struggled before as far as the sim and there was just no emotional capacity left for kind of marriage. There was no peace. He was resenting having having had a second child after our first. You know, everything was great. We had our perfect child and we rocked the boat. We more than rocked it, we capsized the boat and so I was resentful about that and it just. It was a very rough period of time and despite jason saying we're never having another one, um, we decided to have another one.

Speaker 2: 1:10:32

Um, I'm trying to think if there's anything significant between that well, we I mean the I has done a massive, massive, yeah, but even um, and so then I mean, we started the church, and so I'm trying to figure out, kind of where is my place in that I'm now a pastor's wife. Welcome to the party.

Speaker 3: 1:10:52

It's like, hey, I'm going to be a pastor now.

Speaker 2: 1:10:55

Yeah, I've been drafted. So that was something you know, and I'm still navigating that because I have a hard time figuring out that role in tandem with wife, mom, farmer, homesteader you know the things that come with that, and so I don't do the best that I can. And that bothers me as well, because I mean, you want to serve God and fill those shoes in the way that you know you're supposed to. That being pastor's wife is very important and I um, so that's something I'm still navigating. Um, so that was all kind of the transition while we were dealing with the hardest baby in the world. It's like we added this all um onto that, but, um, kind of we got into smoother waters and decided, you know, hoping to round up, lauren'll say that Lauren was right and I was wrong.

Speaker 1: 1:11:46

She believed in Yaya from day one I did, and she fought so hard for her. And she sat in the fire, the furnace, the hell of a screaming room with a child that would not stop screaming and raging, raging. And now Yaya is like joy, screaming and raging, raging. And now Yaya is like joy, and somehow unfairly so she's latched onto me. The guy who was ready to like feed her to the dingoes.

Speaker 2: 1:12:21

I bite my tongue.

Speaker 1: 1:12:22

I'm not going to tell her that you know, lauren never, ever gave up on her, that's a, that's a mama's love. Yeah, that's god, god-given mama's love I would rather be shot at to be in the room with yaya when she was going to that thing.

Speaker 2: 1:12:38

Yeah, so, yeah, so we, we decided we were I mean, we were both, I think you know as far as what is it to be? Christian birth control, managing kids? Do you say no to God? I don't want any more kids, like what is right there.

Speaker 2: 1:12:58

And so we both were kind of feeling led to just take our hands off the wheel on that and say, god, if you take over this, um, and god wanted us to have another one, so and again, I just didn't want you putting poison in your body, although yeah, I mean there's that piece of it, but all that and then, but even like, yeah, I mean family planning and I mean there's, you know, I mean everyone has their own belief, kind of on, to what degree can you control kids, or do you literally just hand it over to God until your body's, I mean, he says you're done, and then the worst day of my life.

Speaker 2: 1:13:34

So I got pregnant and then, a couple of weeks after finding out that I was pregnant, I started having some severe cramps and, more than spotting bleed like a good amount of bleeding, and so I thought I was miscarrying again, cause it was almost identical in experience to when I lost the one before Yaya was born, or we conceived Yaya and um, so it kind of wrapped, you know, my mind mentally, emotionally, around okay, we're losing it. But then nothing happened. Um and I had a couple of episodes over a week or two like that, but never enough for it to be an actual miscarriage, um, so we went to the hospital to get an ultrasound which was awful.

Speaker 2: 1:14:22

Yeah, Cause? Um, because I was using a midwife and I, so I wasn't really connected to any hospital system. I just went to like one local one, to the ultrasound place and the tech wasn't allowed to share anything. And she's kind of, as we were getting ready to leave, she said, like I can share just with you, that there is a heartbeat, but I can't tell you anything else.

Speaker 1: 1:14:44

Yeah. So you know, here we are. We're thinking okay, we have birth defects, issues that you know, you know we're going to lose it. Like is there a dead baby in there? Like I mean going through that ultrasound, there was just nothing, no comments, and other ultrasounds were all like look at this and look at that, and I was just so doom and gloom and we were just horrified.

Speaker 2: 1:15:04

Yeah. So we left with the good news that there was heartbeat, but no other explanation of what was going on. So then we finally got the report that I had something called a subchorionic hemorrhage, which in my case, like I know, there is a big bleed on the bottom, like between my cervix and my uterus. So I mean it's in the placenta. So there was just a big bleed, no known cause. They can vary in size, but mine was the not not so big that it was likely that it was going to cause any problem moving forward. They said it was just going to shrink as the baby got bigger and I didn't have any more bleeding episodes and so we just moved forward. Normal pregnancy I did all of my kind of heavy farm work. Throughout it I felt great, no problem. Um, and then um prepared Nicole, hi, nicole.

Speaker 1: 1:16:02

Um yeah. Good to see you. God bless you and your family.

Speaker 2: 1:16:07

Yeah, so I was preparing for home birth. I did a water birth with Yaya. I was looking forward to having that experience again and I was way more ready for this. We were ready. I was a pro at water birth. Well, yes and no, because my water broke three weeks early. So that threw me for a loop, because B was two weeks late, yaya was one week early, which really caught us off guard, and so I was like, okay, that's kind of my, my window, you know I can deal with that. But then my water broke three weeks early, and so it was still a scramble on getting things together because we thought we had more time.

Speaker 2: 1:16:43

Um, but you know, so I, I, you know, looking back on my phone, I have videos that I was instant, you know, posting on Instagram stories. You know I'm out milking the cows and I'm waiting for contractions to start and you know all this stuff and, um, you know, everyone, I was like we're going to have, you know, probably by tonight you'll be seeing the baby and, um, nothing happened. Nothing happened. Um, I went through that whole day with no contractions. Um, I had a brief start, kind of kind of intense, 30 minutes after I went to bed that night, enough for me to call my midwife over and saying, okay, things like are really gonna go fast now, um, but by the time that she made it to the house it had stopped again and, um, you know, she tried all like the midwife voodoo of like giving me these tinctures and whatever, and you know stuff to just to try to um, jump start it, but I never had any more contractions and jason had gotten the pool, all you know.

Speaker 2: 1:17:45

But when I had to, kind of the episode that I was having contractions, um, he, you know, got it going, because he barely got it done the last time before Yaya was born, um, and the midwife is there.

Speaker 2: 1:17:58

And I was crushed because I knew, you know, in in what I my personally beliefs of kind of why I choose to do home birth versus going to the hospital and the risk of interventions. And you know I knew that if I went into the hospital with stalled labor, that I was going to be put on a lot of the, the drugs to kickstart it and kind of the snowball that can start on ending in C-section. And that was like my worst nightmare of having a C-section. And so I was. I fought it emotionally for several hours that next morning after my midwife had said kind of you've reached the time limit, that I'm comfortable you staying home having with your water being broken, and I'm grateful that my leader stepped in and made the decision. He spoke to my midwife, got all the details and with his medical background and just he's the leader of the house.

Speaker 2: 1:18:54

He said I want you to go in, like we're calling it. I can't, you're not going to live with yourself if something happens to this baby, because you want your dream home birth. So we got things wrapped up. We have some amazing friends who came over to kind of step in on farm work unexpectedly, um go into the hospital and I was a grump for the first couple of hours, kind of cause I just didn't want to be there and um get put on Pitocin and that very quickly started contractions and I kind of got into my own natural rhythm. They were able to stop that had the baby naturally like I wanted, although just not in the environment that I wanted. Three natural births, yeah. And then I I mean so they very quickly I my memory of kind of timelines and things is a little, but my bleeding wouldn't stop. They couldn't get all of the placenta out and so they started having to work really hard on my body and they finally it was, it was attached, it hadn't fully detached in from the uterine wall.

Speaker 1: 1:20:05

And so they called placenta accreta.

Speaker 2: 1:20:05

So at that point they didn't know that all they knew was it hadn't fully detached and from the uterine wall, and so they called placenta credo. So at that point they didn't know that all they knew was it hadn't fully released. So they had to rip it out and they thought that was going to be it, that my body would just clot up like it normally does, um, but I keep bleeding very heavily on and off for the next couple of hours I know jason's has shared this story um, um, and at some point then I, I pass out and that's um, and then they crash team comes in and they, um, are just in there trying to kind of scrape out remaining pieces of placenta, um and I, you know I, I was Um and I, you know I, I was, I was conscious for for the whole experience, but, um, god protected me from being scared about it, um, so I didn't have any. I haven't talked about this, but um.

Speaker 3: 1:20:58

I wasn't like. I wasn't like I didn't have any death moments or like seeing the light or really thoughts at all that it was going to be anything other than okay. I was very calm mentally, uh, which I'm grateful for, because if I had started thinking about sorry, if I had started thinking about sorry, if I had started thinking about I'm going to die, I wouldn't have wanted to go through that experience with, like, what's going to happen to Jason, what's going to happen to my kids?

Speaker 2: 1:21:37

So I'm grateful that God gave me a call through that, so they finally brought me back into the emergency room, operating room to um try to do a DNC to clear, clear me out, but they weren't able to save um, save the uterus, so they gave me a hysterectomy Um and so all I know, I mean I remember things kind of in and out of that, but yeah, so it's.

Speaker 3: 1:22:20

It took me a little bit of peace with what happened, and I do now have peace with what happened, and I do now. I'm so grateful that God saved me to be here with my kids and my husband. I'm at peace that we're not going to be able to have any more kids of our own, so I'm very grateful for that. I'm still working through some memories of that experience, but I'm grateful that I have God to to lean on and that. So that's my testimony. Hold this. Let me film in some things around that it was really close, so that's my testimony Hold this.

Speaker 1: 1:23:08

Let me film in some things around that. It was really close. You know, I've been in a lot of ORs. I've seen a lot of people bleed out. I've seen a lot of people die and if I hadn't been there with Lauren, she'd be dead today because they had basically forgotten about us and you never leave a loved one in the hospital alone. And as far as the natural birth thing, it's okay to be granola, it's okay to be granola. You can be granola and you can do water births and you can want to do all the natural rose petal essence, whatever garbage that you want to do. But when it comes down to my wife's life and my child's life, you got to be able to step up and say, okay, we tried it, it's a reasonable time, so going to the hospital, saving Lauren's life there. If we had tried to deliver that here, she would have bled out.

Speaker 3: 1:24:12

Yeah, so there is.

Speaker 2: 1:24:14

I'm going to have to go soon because he's crying but there was no apparent reason why my water broke three weeks early and there was no apparent reason why my labor didn't start.

Speaker 2: 1:24:30

So I like to think that God brought me to the hospital that he made my labor, not progress, so that I would have had that baby here, and what my midwife thinks that she would have gotten me to the hospital and there's. There's what ifs and all of this stuff that I've gone through, because that's just what your mind does. But I'm grateful that my girls didn't have to see that, even if I would have made it there was so much blood.

Speaker 1: 1:24:54

So, but anyways, I spent my knees asking my wife to. I had to come fight for my wife. They took her at 11. They brought her back at six in the morning. And I just want you to wrap up because I you did a really sweet post the other day. You with him and your rap. You know you feel any more of god's presence or do you feel closer to him? And I know you know, I know you're grateful and all those other things because he spared you.

Speaker 3: 1:25:27

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:25:29

And then I'll go get him.

Speaker 2: 1:25:30

No, well, it's okay, he can yell for a minute or two and then I'll go get him.

Speaker 2: 1:25:40

I wish I could say that I like spend hours in my Bible now, every day, because you know you have a life changing moment and um. But in so many ways life just moves on and I'm in a season where I really struggle with being in the word. But you know, jesus is constantly on my mind and in my heart and I think that you know, even though I don't always have time to sit and read, you know I incorporate him into everything that I'm doing and as much into my parenting as I can. And you know I, just anytime that I have I have my brain will go down the what ifs of you know what, if Jason had to walk back through this door of you know what, if Jason had to walk back through this door with a newborn and two young girls without mom, then I have to just turn to Jesus in those moments because I don't want my mind to go down those thoughts too much Well he protected us from that.

Speaker 1: 1:26:37

Yeah. So love you babe, love you Gato, alright. Alright, we'll be back and then I'll wrap this up and I'll pray us out. Alright, so we'll be back and then I'll wrap this up and then I'll pray us out. All right, so we'll be back in one Good night. All right, we are back. So it's really like 30 seconds when I only do that one. So, again, you know, I'm so proud of my wife. My wife has become such a woman of God and it's just, it's just remarkable. So I hope you guys enjoyed that and it's good to see you, claudia. And again, nicole, what a great treat to see you pop in here as well.

Speaker 1: 1:28:04

Triple Coconut, bob Adrian, all you guys and the 106 people over on Twitter, or whatever is over the 101 over on Twitter. Again, a powerful testimony, but a normal testimony, right? Whatever that is. If there is a normal testimony, but there wasn't a lot of, you know, craziness in it that we hear so many, but that doesn't make it less, less powerful, right? It doesn't make it less powerful, right? It doesn't make it less powerful. All of our testimonies, our history is his story. Our history is his story, right? So we need to share that and it's uncomfortable, need to share that and it's uncomfortable and it brings tears and sometimes it tears open some stuff. But usually what I have found is, every time I tell my testimony and I tear open old wounds as I get deeper healing, the healing continues. Right, the healing continues. So I thank God for saving my wife. I thank God for everything. So let's go ahead and let's pray it out.

Speaker 1: 1:29:21

Thank you, guys. I know we ran a little bit late today, as will happen on Testimony Tuesday. So, heavenly Father, lord, we thank you. We thank you for your daughter, lauren, who loves you, lord, loves you with all her heart. She has become such a woman of God who wants to please you, lord, and serve you. She does that with her family and her friends and those who are around her. Lord, you made her, you know wonderfully with such a heart, such a gift. Thank you for giving her the courage and the vulnerability to share her testimony, her doubts, her fears, her struggles.

Speaker 1: 1:30:12

Lord, I pray that parts of Lauren's story, or all of it, touched us all in some way and will bring us closer to you, but I also pray that you will use her testimony and that it will help someone somewhere right now or tomorrow. This will be on the internet until you come home or until the internet is no more. I pray that someone would see Lauren's testimony and that it would help lead them to you or lead them home. So, lord, we thank you. We thank you for this fellowship in this community. We thank you for people who are tuning in every night to hear about you and to love you and to invest in one another. This is all about investing in one another, lord, and we are here to pursue you with all we have. Lord, we know you don't need anyone or anything, but we volunteer, lord, if you need us to do something, send us. Sorry. If you want us to do something, send us, sorry. If you want us to do something, send us. If you want to use us as a tool with your incredible hands, we volunteer to be the hammer, the screwdriver, the wrench, the saw, the ruler, whatever you want.

Speaker 1: 1:31:42

Lord, I pray a prayer of protection over this fellowship, over anyone who can hear the sound of my voice, over the persecuted church, our troops overseas, our first responders at home and our veterans of yesteryear. Lord, I pray a prayer of protection that you would keep us from World War III and a second civil war here in the US. And lastly, I pray for our beloved America that she would turn from her sin, hit her knees, sink your face and repent, that you would see her and heal her so we could once again be one nation under God. Indivisible liberty and justice for all. Lastly, lord, I call this fellowship to attention and put on the full armor of God. I call this fellowship to attention and put on the full armor of God. Pick up the shield of faith, strap on the shield of faith, pick up the sword of the Spirit and to boldly march forward to join the shield wall, locking shields to the left and right as we march forward to take ground for your kingdom, for your glory, forever In.

Speaker 3: 1:32:42

Jesus' name we pray.

Speaker 1: 1:32:44

Amen, All right, everyone. God bless you and I'll see you tomorrow.